The Camp Consultant

Feedback is a gift. I expand upon this concept highlighted in a previous blog during a recent interview with Tom Sawyer Camps’ Executive Director Sarah Horner Fish.

What stood out most about Tom Sawyer’s counselor evaluation process is that staff are consistently providing each other structured feedback. Rather than merely receiving feedback, as is the case for most camp counselors, Tom Sawyer empowers staff to develop the important muscle of delivering feedback.

You can listen to the full interview audio here.

If you’re a camp professional and want to learn best practices about implementing a feedback system where staff both give and receive constructive feedback (an important 21st century skill!), then this interview is a must read/listen!

Thanks once again Sarah for your time and insights!

-Mario

Sarah Horner Fish, Owner / Executive Director Tom Sawyer Camps

Mario Del Cueto

Tom Sawyer was one of the best examples of feedback that I saw while visiting camps across the country last summer. Sarah, could you spend some time describing the different facets of your counselor evaluation process?

Sarah Horner

We really value feedback and have heard over and over again how much our staff value it, whether it’s constructive or really positive feedback. We start off the summer explaining to our staff that they are going to be evaluated. Unlike sometimes when your friends talk about you, and maybe say not so nice things, we want our staff to become comfortable understanding that feedback and evaluation is a way to grow skills.

There might be some tough feedback, some constructive feedback to help them grow and improve in their job. We don’t want to just say “you’re great, have fun, keep doing what you’re doing!” That’s not specific, it’s not constructive, and misses the opportunity to help our staff grow. So we explain in training “you will be evaluated, you will get feedback.” It’s a two-way street that keeps growing throughout the summer.

At Tom Sawyer we have senior counselors (age 19+), assistant counselors (~17-18) and junior counselors (~15-16). Our senior counselors are the ones who are typically evaluating the assistants and the junior counselors. We start off right away after the first week of camp. Senior Counselors conduct a check-in with their co-counselors, providing feedback right at start. Our evaluation form has changed over the years but essentially, it’s “here’s how you’re doing and here’s how we would like you to improve and grow.”

It’s hard to ask a first-year college student to evaluate someone, most likely for their very first time (they might have even never been evaluated themselves!). So often, we sit down with that senior counselor before they give their evaluation. We look at the form with them. We discuss it… “What are you going to talk about? here are some ideas to improve it.” Through this, they’re able to have things filled out the evaluation form in a way that is productive for both them and the person receiving the feedback. And oftentimes we will have a director sit in with them for that first eval, just to help them talk things through things, especially if they want that support.

Mario Del Cueto 

How often are senior counselors conducting evaluations throughout the summer?

Sarah Horner 

Our goal is every two weeks, and we run nine weeks, so typically, they’re getting evaluated four times throughout the summer. We also ask the people getting evaluated to come with their own goals and objectives to each chat, pointing out where they’re doing well, and areas where they think they can improve.

Often, the person getting evaluated brings pretty much the same growth opportunities and positive points that the person evaluating them has thought of. They typically are aligned and when they don’t align, that’s okay. It’s an opportunity to say, “Oh, that’s great. You want to work on those things, here are some things I want to challenge you to work on as well.”

Mario Del Cueto

Okay, got it. And how do you find the time to do this four times throughout the summer, in an often hectic camp day?

Sarah Horner 

We really try to support the staff with having a director sit with the children to give the group counselors time to conduct the eval. Alternatively, counselors will hold the eval during an activity where they don’t need director support, at an activity that’s lower risk and has ample supervision, like at Nature when the kids are learning about tree cookies.

Mario Del Cueto 

If I understand correctly, the senior counselor comes with a form prepared, right? They are not just saying the first thing that comes to mind? There are specific questions that they must answer, and a specific section to record the goals that the younger counselors are thinking about?

Sarah Horner

Exactly. Mario, it’s so important to have things written down prior, and to have a form for a couple reason. First, because the counselor has taken the time to write these things down… they have thought through things, they may have gotten help from their supervisor… they’re sharing fully developed thoughts.

It’s also important because I’ve heard over and over again, how nervous staff were to get evaluated. By having a form in front of you, to see the written words… for some people looking at the form helps them process the feedback better. We make copies of the forms, give it to each counselor, so they can take it home and reread it, making it easier to remember and understand the feedback.

We also do a self-evaluation, which makes for great talking points. It’s important to reflect on the job you’re doing. Some counselors might say, “oh, you know what, I don’t say hi to all my campers every day.” Whereas we know that touchpoint makes such a huge difference in saying good morning to each one of your campers. That’s an example of the several different categories where they can evaluate themselves. And it might be the first time they are reflecting, even though we might have emphasized this in training, and that is powerful in itself.

Mario Del Cueto 

Your evaluation program touches on so many of these important 21st century skills that we know that camp promotes, right? From reflection, to giving feedback, to receiving feedback, to effective communication skills….

Sarah Horner 

I want to add something really great to about 21st century skills and receiving feedback. So often, it’s the first time our staff are receiving any kind of feedback. They had never truly been evaluated. I mean, maybe on a sports team, you have a coach who has said “good job” or you have a teacher that assigned a grade, but it’s rarely specific and actionable feedback. Camp allows these counselors to sit down and have a meaningful two-way feedback conversation.

Mario Del Cueto 

You’re touching on upward feedback there, which is another skill that not everyone is able to demonstrate. And camp can be a great testing ground for that, to empower counselors to say (at camp and in the future “hey, if we adjust our working style in this way, I think it’ll lead to a better group dynamic.”  And we know that that’s so important.

Final question: If another camp out there was trying to institute a similar system, what are some key watch outs / best practices you’d like to share?

Sarah Horner 

First, talk to your staff in training. Even before this, during the actual interview process, tell your staff they will be evaluated. I think it’s so important for our staff to know about evaluations from the get-go. Make it part of your culture.

I’m not sure if you found this Mario during your camp tours, but so many of our staff are really high achieving. They’re doing great things, they’re going to fantastic colleges, they have fantastic internships. So for them to hear that they’re going to be getting feedback, and some of it will be constructive, it can be a little scary these people who have excelled so well in their life so far. I think letting them know that they will get feedback in advance, helps soften the blow a bit and underscores evals as a true opportunity to grow.

I also think start small.  You don’t have to create this whole system that’s going to work perfectly. We have adjusted our evaluation system every summer, I would say start small… create a simple form:

• Here are things that Mario is great at,
• Here are things I’d like Mario to improve on,
• What are Mario’s goals for the next eval

And then I would also say, support your staff in conducting the evaluations. When they need air cover to supervise their campers, when they need help write it, support them in those ways. I think it’s so important that we don’t just assume staff know how to receive and deliver feedback, so start small with that too.

Additionally, you can always adjust your process. Ask your staff for feedback. How did it go? They might give you some really great ideas.

One more thing I want to add: don’t wait for your evaluation session to give specific feedback. That’s important. If you have something that’s critical, you want to make it timely. You don’t want to wait till two weeks to say, “Oh hey, Mario, when you were helping that camper with this, it wasn’t okay what you did” or whatever. Pull the counselor aside, don’t do it in front of their peers or their campers, but make sure you deliver feedback in a timely manner.

Mario Del Cueto

Sarah, it’s been great chatting with you! Anything else to share?

Sarah Horner

If anyone who comes across this wants any help or advice or wants to see our forms, I’d be happy to connect. Thanks, Mario! Have a good day.

Note to readers: Please let me know if you found the text transcript of the interview helpful! It was quite time intensive to create but if readers are finding it useful (as a supplement to or in place of the interview audio), I’ll continue to transcribe. Leave a comment or email me at mariodc37@gmail.com with your thoughts. Thank you!